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Post by LTB on Mar 13, 2020 20:09:32 GMT -5
I had replaced just the Neck pickup (590N ) in my 2016 Gibson SG Standard with a Kent Armstrong PAF (Alnico 3) pickup. Then due to other (self inflicted) issues I needed to replace the Neck Volume Pot. Since it had a circuit board I decided to replace the pots, caps, Jack, and switch. I was about to order all new components when I found an Emerson Circuit that used 50's style circuit wiring configuration. It had a .022uf cap for the Bridge and a .015uf for the neck. The neck pickup tone cap caused the pickup to be much brighter, even a little too bright for me. I then decided to install a set of Lindy Fralin Pure PAF's. Installed them and they sounded great. Then, I decided to Order a .022uf Emerson "Bumblebee" cap matching the ones in the new Emerson circuit. In addition I ordered a 500K pot with push/pull switch so as to switch between a .015uf and .022uf tone caps. I Checked value of each cap and tested the switch and pot to insure all was as should be. After installing I hooked the guitar up to the amp and play.
Here is where the interesting part comes into play. No perceived difference in tone with switch in normal or when Pot is pulled to extended position. I checked with ohm meter and capacitance tester that each cap was indeed connected correctly and not shorting to one another.
In past I have also noticed some guitar pickups react slightly differently to type and quality cable being used. Some hear these differences and some do not. I am one who does (probably due to my hearing frequencies.
With this finding I reinstalled the original Pot and left the .022uf cap in place
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Post by LTB on Mar 13, 2020 23:06:07 GMT -5
Notice: Before anyone says anything about Bumblebee Paper and Oil Caps. I consider this "snake oil". I purchased the Emerson pre-assembled circuit because of the beautiful job and attention to detail on the Circuit as a whole. The Bumblebee caps are simply their Paper and Oil caps with a "photo imaged" thin plastic cover around them that is easy to scratch off. They just add the look of the original Bumblebee caps used in early 50's Gibsons. They just look cool. When Radio Shack was open in my area, I used to use little Green "Chicklet" caps that cost about 50 cents I guess and they worked just fine. I do think different pickups react differently to different value of Capacitors and I have seen here.
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Mar 13, 2020 23:30:59 GMT -5
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Post by LTB on Mar 14, 2020 1:05:12 GMT -5
Upon reading your first link I ran into this: "The capacitor only contributes to guitar’s tone when you lower the tone pot. If you always play with your tone pot wide open, none of this matters." I know the above it typical but that is the reason for my post and interest. With Both Volume and Tone Pot all the way up ("10") with one brand pickup a .015uf made it sound brighter but with the Fralins it didn't matter a "Hill of Beans". In fact there was little perceived difference in the tone as you turned it down slowly while strumming whether the .015uf or whether the .022uf were selected. That is different than any other time I have selected values on other instruments whether they be my basses or previous guitars. Could it be possible part of this is the way the tone cap (50's style circuit) is connected |
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Mar 14, 2020 8:08:35 GMT -5
The 50's wiring should not have made a difference.
Did you hook up the different pickups directly to rule out the possibility that one brand of pickups was simply brighter sounding than the other?
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Post by LTB on Mar 14, 2020 8:21:43 GMT -5
The 50's wiring should not have made a difference. Did you hook up the different pickups directly to rule out the possibility that one brand of pickups was simply brighter sounding than the other? Yes sir I did. It wasn't just the fact the Kent Armstrong Alnico 3 was brighter on the .015uf. It is the fact the Lindy Fralins had no discernible difference in tone whether it be on the .015uf or the .022uf, even when rolling the tone pot down. They reacted the exact same way rolling the tone pot to zero or at full. I initially thought they mis-marked the caps and maybe they were the same value so I verified they were indeed .015uf (.0147) and .022uf (.02197) |
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Post by Leftee on Mar 14, 2020 8:29:49 GMT -5
Upon reading your first link I ran into this: "The capacitor only contributes to guitar’s tone when you lower the tone pot. If you always play with your tone pot wide open, none of this matters." I know the above it typical but that is the reason for my post and interest. With Both Volume and Tone Pot all the way up ("10") with one brand pickup a .015uf made it sound brighter but with the Fralins it didn't matter a "Hill of Beans". In fact there was little perceived difference in the tone as you turned it down slowly while strumming whether the .015uf or whether the .022uf were selected. That is different than any other time I have selected values on other instruments whether they be my basses or previous guitars. Could it be possible part of this is the way the tone cap (50's style circuit) is connected I noted this on a guitar years ago. It was a LP Clone and I installed a set of custom-wound pickups. I used the ‘50s style wiring and both neck and bridge had a .022uF tone cap. I felt that the neck pickup was a bit too wooly so I swapped that .022 out for a .015. It did shift the tone out of the wooly zone just enough. And that with the tone pot turned all the way up. I’ve tried that trick in other guitars with the same wiring and noticed no change. |
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Post by LTB on Mar 14, 2020 22:31:06 GMT -5
Upon reading your first link I ran into this: "The capacitor only contributes to guitar’s tone when you lower the tone pot. If you always play with your tone pot wide open, none of this matters." I know the above it typical but that is the reason for my post and interest. With Both Volume and Tone Pot all the way up ("10") with one brand pickup a .015uf made it sound brighter but with the Fralins it didn't matter a "Hill of Beans". In fact there was little perceived difference in the tone as you turned it down slowly while strumming whether the .015uf or whether the .022uf were selected. That is different than any other time I have selected values on other instruments whether they be my basses or previous guitars. Could it be possible part of this is the way the tone cap (50's style circuit) is connected I noted this on a guitar years ago. It was a LP Clone and I installed a set of custom-wound pickups. I used the ‘50s style wiring and both neck and bridge had a .022uF tone cap. I felt that the neck pickup was a bit too wooly so I swapped that .022 out for a .015. It did shift the tone out of the wooly zone just enough. And that with the tone pot turned all the way up. I’ve tried that trick in other guitars with the same wiring and noticed no change. Thanks, that gives me some assurance I am not totally crazy. I will just note it and move on.  |
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Post by walshb 🦒 on Mar 15, 2020 9:24:25 GMT -5
From everything I've read, the Pure PAF's are great pickups. I didn't know about them at the time, so I went with the Fralin True 60's offered by RS Guitarworks. These are also great, and I think similar to the Pure PAFs but maybe different magnets?
I don't think I tried the 50's wiring, but I probably won't mess with it because I'm happy with the pickups the way they are. I changed the pots and caps also, using the kit from RS Guitarworks. This was all done on my Historic Reissue Les Paul, a 2006 model. Hard to believe it's already 14 years old now.
The only other guitar I've changed caps on was an Epi gold top Les Paul that I still own. It was very bright, I think I ended up going with a .047uf on the bridge.
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Post by LTB on Mar 15, 2020 14:08:22 GMT -5
From everything I've read, the Pure PAF's are great pickups. I didn't know about them at the time, so I went with the Fralin True 60's offered by RS Guitarworks. These are also great, and I think similar to the Pure PAFs but maybe different magnets? I don't think I tried the 50's wiring, but I probably won't mess with it because I'm happy with the pickups the way they are. I changed the pots and caps also, using the kit from RS Guitarworks. This was all done on my Historic Reissue Les Paul, a 2006 model. Hard to believe it's already 14 years old now. The only other guitar I've changed caps on was an Epi gold top Les Paul that I still own. It was very bright, I think I ended up going with a .047uf on the bridge. I believe I just read your post from 2006 on the Les Paul forum. RS Guitar Works is proud of the RS Fralin 60’s at $449. They both are using alnico 2 magnets but the 60’s are more aggressive sounding |
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Post by walshb 🦒 on Mar 15, 2020 14:55:01 GMT -5
I believe I just read your post from 2006 on the Les Paul forum. RS Guitar Works is proud of the RS Fralin 60’s at $449. They both are using alnico 2 magnets but the 60’s are more aggressive sounding I think I purchased them in 2007, they were nowhere near that much back then! |
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Post by LTB on Mar 15, 2020 22:07:26 GMT -5
I believe I just read your post from 2006 on the Les Paul forum. RS Guitar Works is proud of the RS Fralin 60’s at $449. They both are using alnico 2 magnets but the 60’s are more aggressive sounding I think I purchased them in 2007, they were nowhere near that much back then! Correction: The RS Fralin 60’s have alnico 4 magnets and wound a little more while RS Fralin true 60’s have Alnico 2 magnets and similarly wound to Lindy Fralin Pure PAF’s |
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