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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 2, 2020 7:54:40 GMT -5
I've installed some GFS Truecoil noiseless (stacked single coil sized) pickups in my strat and am having a hum in positions 2 and 3.
The guitar is noiseless in the bridge alone, middle/neck, and neck alone.
In the bridge/middle and middle alone it's humming.
I've it wired with 1 volume and 1 tone (master). All 3 pickups are grounded to the volume pot.
I figure it has to be an issue with the middle pickup but can't find anything wired wrong plus the fact that the middle/neck is quiet has got me baffled.
Any help is appreciated.
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Jan 2, 2020 8:19:25 GMT -5
Try the following: With the guitar plugged in, select the bridge pickup and touch each of the polepieces with a fingertip. They should be quiet. This applies to all the pickups (test them all this way). Sometimes a the coil is shorted to a polepiece--usually one on the end--and this can make a pickup noisy.
If they're all quiet, then there's something else going on. Have you double-checked your wiring? A second pair of eyeballs on it is invaluable.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 2, 2020 11:04:09 GMT -5
I tried the fingertip test and it isn't that.
Any other tips or tests?
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Jan 3, 2020 0:01:09 GMT -5
Sounds like it may be a miswired pickup. For instance, if a pickup has two leads (one black, one white) when bought as a set, all the color codes will be properly matched.
The middle pickup may have the color codes reversed. Try flipping that pickup's connections in the control cavity--at the switch and the ground on the V pot.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 3, 2020 1:21:30 GMT -5
These came as a set but I will give that a try
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DrKev
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It's just a guitar, it's not rocket science.
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Post by DrKev on Jan 3, 2020 16:30:59 GMT -5
If noiseless pickups are quiet on their own, they should be just about that quiet in combination too. If these are simple two-wire pickups, you may have a grouding issue or wiring issue on the selector switch.
Edit: I've just re-read your first post, I don;t understand why the middle pickup can be noisy (it shouldn't be) but not have noise in position 2.
Can you post your wiring diagram?
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Jan 3, 2020 22:34:37 GMT -5
DrKev, I agree...the issue is perplexing because it's noisy in position 2 but not position 4.
Let's see what chronicinsomnia reports back with.
Cheers, brother!
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Post by LM on Jan 4, 2020 13:54:55 GMT -5
Maybe a cold solder joint somewhere on the switch?
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gbfun
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Post by gbfun on Jan 5, 2020 6:27:00 GMT -5
Hi ! I ordered a factory pickguard from a place that will remain nameless due to it's extreme lack of support. The person created the pickguard from hell where the polarity was North South South and I got a quacking type sound in position 2, so it was never even bench tested. My understanding is the ideal magnetic polarity of 3 pickups should be North South North or South North South. This can be checked with a simple compass. However, I didn't fix my problem with position 2 by altering the strange pattern I received. Yes there are youtube vids that show people actually CHANGING the magnetic field of a pickup, but I sure wasn't going to try that. With my luck, every pole in my pickup would end up with a different magnetic strength...or pointing sideways ! So I kept the odd North South South pattern. However, since there was an obvious problem between positions 2 and 3, I read some more on the net and came to the conclusion that I had TWO reverse wound pickups installed in positions 1 and 3. Ideally, the way I understand it, the middle pickup should be reverse wound from the neck and the bridge pickups. And since the bridge and middle were ok, the neck had to be reverse wound too. So...I simply swapped the wires for the NECK pickup on the switch and all was good ! If that is indeed your issue, then try that. And for those of you running over to your vintage strats with a compass in hand...you lucky dogs.... well yes, some vintage guitars went north north north etc. but they aren't well known for being all that quiet, right ? Just sublime...  |
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DrKev
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It's just a guitar, it's not rocket science.
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Post by DrKev on Jan 5, 2020 6:37:55 GMT -5
Noiseless pickups don't have any NSN/RWRP requirement. Yes, they are single coil size and shape and sound (don't @ me) but think from the point of view of installation, think of them as two-conductor humbuckers, not standard single coils. They should all be silent on their own and in combination. If they are out of phase in combination you'll get a thin, weak, bright sound. But no matter how you wire them, the noise should be no worse than 2x the noise of any one pickup (which is practically zero with a clean tone).
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pdf64
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Post by pdf64 on Jan 5, 2020 8:21:05 GMT -5
Yes, something whacky may be going on, the description in the OP defies logic really. If a 2nd test of everything checks out then best to contact the manufacturer.
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gbfun
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Post by gbfun on Jan 6, 2020 2:50:36 GMT -5
Oh goodness ! I obviously can't read late at night. Many pardons ! The noise was stated to be between the bridge and middle, not the middle and neck. However, I remember reading that noiseless stacked humbucker single coils are not always 100% humbuckers so they aren't always "noiseless". In short, there is a small percentage of the original coil that isn't "bucked". Therefore, the remaining portion might still act and interact like a single coil. So if the bridge is wound the same as the middle, there could be the same noise single coils might make, but perhaps less. If your pickups keep some of the tone but are "mostly noiseless"(this is the art of it), then the middle pickup might still need to be reverse wound from whatever the bridge winding is, and looking won't help when they are sometimes mismarked as I found out the hard way. You could have a wound bridge, wound middle and reverse wound neck ! Or a reverse wound bridge, reverse wound middle and wound neck. Of course it could be something else, but you could experiment by swapping the neck and middle in the hope the noise goes away because the interaction with the bridge goes away and you would then have a normal configuration. Maybe.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 6, 2020 10:09:04 GMT -5
I have gone as far as bypassing the tone controls completely and wiring the pickups (2 wire) all grounds to volume pot and the hot wire going to the 5 way switch still getting hum in the second and middle position.
I had a loaded pickguard from another guitar and swapped the guts into this one volume/2 tones/5 way switch. So currently it is wired like a standard strat.
I played it yesterday in church (modern worship band) I avoided the hum positions. I have the same set in another guitar and haven't had this issue. The tone is great the two guitars sound almost identical. One has this hum and the other doesn't. I've checked and rechecked my solder joints.
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gbfun
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Post by gbfun on Jan 7, 2020 4:19:20 GMT -5
Ok, that's interesting indeed. It's "grasping at straws time" for sure ! The facts are : with two sets of pickups wired exactly the same, there is a hum on one set in position 2 and 3, and the pickups are stacked humbuckers and shouldn't interact very strongly, AND the wiring has been checked and double checked. (we number oppositely, that's why I got confusaled before) So, howabout... 1) switch problem or a 2) pickup problem ? I read somewhere that pickups can be damaged to the point the wiring in the coil breaks and/or shorts, or it was a messed up coil in the first place. A bad middle would explain hum in pos 2 and 3 then. Supposedly using a multi meter in the ohm setting and seeing the values unable to stabilize is one clue. I saw a vid on youtube explain the testing of it. However, if pos 4 is ok, then it's not going to be a bad middle, right ? So without any other option so far, perhaps you have a bad switch ? If you can't see something obvious you'll have to try a different switch that you know works already. If the switch is ok and the pos 3 pickup is ok, then it's down to every wire, solder and resistor. Hmm...it could be a bad tone pot if it's set up for the middle pickup only ! Even better, perhaps a badly GROUNDED pot ? Anyway, there's some more ideas. Good luck !
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Wrnchbndr
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Post by Wrnchbndr on Jan 7, 2020 11:52:03 GMT -5
I'm gonna take a leap and suggest that you have the pickups in the wrong position. Is it possible that you have the intended middle pickup sitting in the bridge location?
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Post by LTB on Jan 8, 2020 3:39:38 GMT -5
I have gone as far as bypassing the tone controls completely and wiring the pickups (2 wire) all grounds to volume pot and the hot wire going to the 5 way switch still getting hum in the second and middle position. I had a loaded pickguard from another guitar and swapped the guts into this one volume/2 tones/5 way switch. So currently it is wired like a standard strat. I played it yesterday in church (modern worship band) I avoided the hum positions. I have the same set in another guitar and haven't had this issue. The tone is great the two guitars sound almost identical. One has this hum and the other doesn't. I've checked and rechecked my solder joints.
Try reversing the wire polarity on the middle pickup. It is possible they are reverse wired when made. Stranger things have happened. I had to do that on one set many moons ago.
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Jan 8, 2020 7:54:55 GMT -5
The possibility exists that one (or more) of the pickups is just FUBAR from the factory. In the manufacturing world the common calculation for defective products is 2%; the pickup set you have just may be a two-percenter.
I mention this because many years ago I ordered an alnico Strat pickup from GFS. It arrived dead in the water. Continuity through the coil was perfectly to spec, but the alnico slugs were not magnetized. I called GFS to arrange a return; they said keep it--and they sent me a replacement.
Send GFS an email describing your issue and include a link to this thread to show them you're not just some goober with a soldering stick.
This one is a corker for sure.
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Post by Leftee on Jan 8, 2020 8:16:51 GMT -5
I’ve bought quite a few sets of pickups from them, over the years, and have had issues a couple of times. One such issue (maybe 12 years ago?) was a set of grey bobbin none stagger ‘60s Strat pickups. The middle pickup was supposed to be rwrp and wasn’t. The set was noisy in 2 and 4. I contacted GFS and they sent me another set. They were the same. This time I swapped the leads from the middle pickup and all was well.
Last year I ordered another set of these for a different guitar. Guess what. I had to swap the leads from the middle pickup. They never corrected the issue in manufacturing.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 8, 2020 17:05:21 GMT -5
I contacted GFS and they want me to send them a picture of the current wiring. I will do it but I am about tired of cracking open this guitar for the thousandth time.
I did send them the link to this thread.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 10, 2020 9:21:18 GMT -5
I believe it is the pickup itself. Since the pickup has the kwikplug system I swapped the middle and neck plugs the middle still hums and neck is quiet. To eliminate it being an issue with the tone knob's wiring I then swapped the middle and bridge same results.
No matter where the middle pickup is I'm getting the same hum.
I've contacted GFS and am awaiting their response.
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Jan 10, 2020 13:40:00 GMT -5
THAT sounds like it. When a problem moves with a specific part, that's a pretty good indicator.
One of the reasons I'm a fan of GFS is they've always been responsive to customers.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 10, 2020 15:00:21 GMT -5
GFS wants me to send them the pickup for testing. If they determine that it is defective they will send me a new pickup and refund my shipping. If they can't get it to behave the same way they will give me a store credit and I'm out the shipping.
I'm not wanting anything for free however, this is a bit of a pain in the rump to have to ship the pickup wait on their results and hope that they come to the same conclusion. I'm hoping the process is quick. I have literally bought over 30 pickups from GFS and this is the first I've ever had an issue with.
I've got another guitar that is identical to this one (different color) with the same model pickups. Before I send it off I am going to swap the middle pickup into the one without the problem just to make 100% sure. I keep second guessing everything but I'm 99% sure it's the pickup.
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Jan 10, 2020 18:41:25 GMT -5
That is a GREAT idea.
I know you have experience with this stuff so I know you're capable of properly wiring up a guitar. That's why I figured it was a problem with a pickup itself.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 11, 2020 17:25:00 GMT -5
Swapped out the pickup and the problem went with the pickup to the other guitar.
So I am going to send it back to GFS.
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gbfun
Wholenote
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Post by gbfun on Jan 14, 2020 2:08:55 GMT -5
Congrats ! That's an easy fix.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 14, 2020 10:24:46 GMT -5
I guess I get to wait for them to test it. I'm 100% certain it is the pickup and hope that they come to the same conclusion. If they don't I'm only out the shipping and will get a store credit. Until they give me a verdict I have a guitar with an empty middle position.
oh well. The law of averages says I had to get a dud at some point. I would like to thank everyone for the input towards helping me solve this.
When I found out the old forum was going away I was most upset about losing the vast and varied knowledge base. I'm so thankful that we still have a place.
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Post by chronicinsomnia on Jan 17, 2020 9:36:18 GMT -5
Shipped it back to GFS via UPS. It arrived yesterday afternoon. Thought I would update the progress. Shipped 1/13/19 arrived 1/16/19 2:27 pm.
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