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Post by Larry Madsen on Dec 13, 2020 20:07:20 GMT -5
I've been trying to pay better attention to what I'm doing and possibly understanding things better. I've never spent much time trying to learn a lot of existing music. Mostly just puttered around with what ever comes to mind. Anyway, I decided to figure out a song I have liked for a long time ... mainly because it seemed real simple and it has some distinctive chord changes going on. I'm aware of many of the "most popular" chord progressions and what do I find? The one I am looking at is a bit odd in that it's not among the most popular we hear. This one is: I - iii - vi - V through the verses with some occasional ii and IV creating some pretty nice changes of mood in the chorus. On another note, I've found myself paying a lot more attention to bass lines lately as well. I can certainly say this, having the music room here at all times ready to go sure makes this a lot easier and more fun. Though out my life I've always had guitars around, but never at-the-ready like I have now. I'm not sure what my point is here, maybe just me rambling over some silly epiphany everyone else takes for granted.  |
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Post by roly on Dec 14, 2020 2:07:35 GMT -5
Hi Larry
Give us a hint.....what song?...:>)
Yes....the basement holds up the house......that should read bass and drums.
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Post by Larry Madsen on Dec 14, 2020 8:03:24 GMT -5
Give us a hint.....what song?...:>) Yes, I suppose I could let you in on that, huh. Till it Shines ... Bob Seger |
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Dec 18, 2020 11:31:05 GMT -5
Great song. Bob Seger has a knack for writing some of the most distinctive melodies. I got to see him live in the 70s and he and his band were at the top of their game. Most of the crowd was there to see Jimmy Buffett, but I was there for Seger. Buffett was good too though!
When you learn a song with changes and chord voicings that are off the beaten path like this, chances are good they were written on the piano. Bob Seger, James Taylor, and Jackson Browne all come to mind.
And it's good to pay attention to what the bass is doing. For instance, when you're looking at a chord chart and you see a slash chord, e.g., D/Gb (D chord with Gb in the bass), nine times out of 10 the studio recording of the song has the guitar player hitting a D chord and the bass player is providing the Gb.
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Post by Larry Madsen on Dec 18, 2020 18:58:47 GMT -5
In looking at *The Weight* by The Band. They have that going on with an E chord with G# in the bass during the chorus. It's a quick passing thing.
A very distinctive, but easily overlooked part in the feel of the song.
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Post by larryguitar54 on Dec 19, 2020 14:34:58 GMT -5
The way I learned stuff:
a.) I was about 12 when I got my first guitar and a Mel Bay book and learned Little Brown Jug and Greensleeves etc. I decided at some point to stay away from B7 and augmented chords as much as possible.
b.) I first started playing with others when I was about 12 and learned the all important E D A "G-L-O-R-I-A" progression.
c.) Pretty soon I figured out 98% of all music was the same progressions of I IV V in some variation. There was also the "Doo Wap" C Am F G progression.
d.) One of the things I learned recently is that somehow a C#m chord seems to work everywhere in any song any place. I don't know why. But it's true.
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Post by Larry Madsen on Dec 19, 2020 18:06:19 GMT -5
I learned recently is that somehow a C#m chord seems to work everywhere in any song any place. Certainly a part of the song I mentioned above (The Weight) A C#m D throughout the verses. Which I suppose makes it a I - iii - IV (Key of A) |
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dlxrev
Halfnote
Posts: 60
Formerly Known As: DLXREV
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Post by dlxrev on Feb 17, 2021 22:48:10 GMT -5
Far be it from me to contradict Mr. Peegoo who is MUCH smarter than I but in the key of D wouldn’t it be D/F# even though they are enharmonic?
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Post by theprofessor on Feb 18, 2021 18:45:00 GMT -5
Far be it from me to contradict Mr. Peegoo who is MUCH smarter than I but in the key of D wouldn’t it be D/F# even though they are enharmonic? I was wondering the same thing, but his reputation casts a long shadow, so I figured there’d been some agreement hammered out at a recent compositional convention. |
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Post by Larry Madsen on Feb 18, 2021 20:37:52 GMT -5
I notice Mr. Goo did not mention any particular "key" he simply referred to a ... (D chord with Gb in the bass) Not that any defense by me is necessary  |
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Post by Peegoo 🏁 on Mar 15, 2021 1:53:56 GMT -5
That was just an example of walking down the bass line against a chord. Correctly written, it is an F#. I don't mind being called out by you guys  |
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Grizbear-NJ
Wholenote
"I'll do the BEATING around here"
Posts: 217
Age: 71
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Post by Grizbear-NJ on Mar 16, 2021 11:44:24 GMT -5
OK: I'll jump in here to address reading and understanding music from a drummers point of view. I have to agree with "roly" that bass & drums constitutes the foundation of many a song. As a drummer I have the ability to figure out tempos & rhythms from the drum score (sheet music); but in a lot of cases it left you hanging, and mandated that you improvise whatever you thought was appropriate (artistic license). In a lot of situations, the score, would read: "insert drum fill or break"; "play with feeling"; "underscore the vocalist". My favorite was "tacit", but I digress. My favorite expression when playing different Jams was to "Improvise and Free Style". Good fun and great memories!
When I retired from my real job; I took up bass guitar to improve my reading, and to get a better grip on the musical piece by looking at the bass line. I figured if I could think like the bass player (regarding music), it would improve the overall quality of the song. If I never heard the song before; the bass line would give me an idea or feel for the music. Especially handy if the musical director decided to improvise something or insert an unexpected change.
Another trick I used was to check out the "Horn" score to capitalize on the rhythm of the "horn stabs" to accent them, and to work in breaks & fills accordingly. Full disclosure: I am definitely a better drummer than a bass player. I do have a basic understanding of "Key" and chord progressions; and again, with that knowledge I can anticipate certain changes and alterations I need to make while playing. Here is one example that I have no documentary proof to offer. My playing experience has taught me that if there is a "Key" change in the song; there is usually a tempo or rhythm change right along with it. Go figure.
Regarding Mr. Peegoo; A great player at any Jam I have had the pleasure to attend with him.
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