Where does tone *really* come from?

Thanks for that. Very interesting.

The guy is dang sharp for sure but I don't think he went far enough.

He used the same electronics and after all my experiments trying to build backup guitars, and failing miserably, my focus is on what the little resistor thingies and the tone knob is doing to the sound.

My recent project had two guitars of the same model, from the same factory, in the same year, with Stewmac Parson pickups and the same electronics.

And they didn't sound the same at all.

But one guitar had a tone pot that rolls off so much high end that the 1st string is almost muted. But is this the tone pot or the resistor thingy ? I did notice that while both guitars had the same thingy, one had writing up, while the other faced down. Is the thingy backwards ? I doubt it, but maybe. Or is it the dang tone pot ?

The reason I mention this is because the tester's cheaper guitar has different, and likely cheaper, electronics...with pots and thingys with different values.

What would have been more eye opening to me is if he had hooked his cheaper guitar to the electronics of the expensive guitar and then have the cheaper guitar sound exactly like the expensive one ! But I wouldn't be that surprised either.

So by using the same electronics as the expensive guitar for his "bench guitar", it didn't really prove enough in my opinion.

I think I got that right. If he'd only gone one step further and used the electronics he already had out on the bench and hooked it to the cheaper guitar, and compared that sound to the bench guitar sound and the expensive guitar sound, a better test would have been performed.

As for my guitars, I'm left with one set of pickups that have covers while the other set is bare. The covered pickups are 7.1K and 7.9K while the bare is 7.3 and 9.0. They have the same magnets. I'm not sure all that really makes that much difference...but SOMETHING IS.

If it's not covers and slight variances in ohms, then it must be the electronics.

So I wish that guy had gone one step further to bring some extra data into the light.

There are lots of stories where people pulled out the old electronics and vastly improved the sound of their guitars !

Why not test that ?

Wasn't this already settled on the FDP?

We agreed that tone is in the hat, a la SRV.

A non-musician friend sent me a link to that video the other week. This is some of what I sent him back:


"You're familiar with The Princess and the Pea and Goldilocks, right? (Most) musicians have a very intimate relationship with their instruments. The spacing of the strings on a guitar for instance can be felt in ridiculously small increments. The same goes for perception of tone. While to most an a/b comparison of 2 guitars may not produce a discernible difference, many players will find happiness in a very small "sweet spot" that others may roll their eyes at. Then there is the "if you believe it then it's true" factor. While Roy Hobbs bat Wonderboy may have possessed some properties conducive with science and actual advantage, believing it was magical made him a better hitter. A guitarist will always play more inspired on an instrument he/she believes is superior.

I'm of the camp that believes it's a "sum of all parts" equation. That includes the player. Two equally skilled guitarists trading off the same guitar will always produce different results."

Tone clearly comes from the amp.

Unplugged electric is wimpy, wimpy wimpy!

If nothing else, it makes one rethink the whole "tone is in the fingers" theory.

I've switched electronics (quickswap board, so don't have to change strings) in my Gibsons, they are brother and sister, same woods, same pickups)

Only color differences.

The wine red does classic jazzbox MUCH better.

The Artic White one is a dead ringer for the Sex Pistols/New York Dolls snarl.


(and swapping stuff, doesn't matter in this case, they retain character!)

I've done pickups AND boards, and just boards.  

I definitely agree that it's a factor, there is no doubt.  I also think some people put too much emphasis on it.  Rather than reopen that whole argument.....how's your weather been lately?

Hmmm, he never investigated vintage vs new pickguard screws.

Tone for me is the quick detach, no screw pickguard on Les Pauls!

CURSES, I'VE TOLD YOU MY SECRET.

The only valid option is to become what the guitar wants you to become.

EMBRACE MR. LEATHER.

I should note I have a '69 MIJ Mustang RI that is in a domestic color, "Revolt yellow" with a factory very hot Duncan bucker.

It's actually pretty sedate.

I have a guitarist friend that claims "Tone is in the fingers". Yeah, I get it is part of it but to me the guitar and amp play a big part too. Wow, interesting. That video tears a lot of assumptions I and maybe many others had. Seems String, String height and pickup make the biggest difference. To me a rosewood fretboard sounds warmer than an oak fretboard which to me is a little brighter sounding.

Cool video.

See my tagline.

Tonally the 2x4 and the boutique are very close.


That said there are a plethora of other things that doesn't effect the sound. (here the test just consisted of strumming chords)

Playability...

If a neck was made with inferior wood... you get dead spots. If the trust rod is not  set correctly, the guitar goes out of tune the second you dig in and shake a chord or note. (same goes if the neck joint isn't glued in right) Proper nut spacing and height.. with a decent material. Tuning pegs.. quality tuning pegs... again staying in tune and sustainability. Fret material... different quality of fret wire... cheap Chinese pot metal wears quicker than xxxx.. a proper fret dressing. etc etc..

Although this doesn't effect the totality it effects the performance and function.

As fare as "Tone is in the hands" lot of different definitions.

My definition revolves around ... doesn't matter the guitar or amp. I will always play my style... my phrasing, my pick attack, note selection, chord strumming etc etc... To the listener, I believe they hear the player choice of notes and chords. They hear an A chord, or a triplet of a b c in A minor....  things like the mid hump of a boutique humbucker is secondary, & applies to the distinguished listener only.