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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 20, 2024 11:46:27 GMT -5
If I could mark on my calendar when my ASUS tower would finally give up the ghost, I'd order a new one on Amazon one week before, back everything up, and let it run into the ground. But, I don't have that clairvoyance.
I have a 10 year old tower that is as slow as you'd expect, but I don't have large demands for it. I am just reluctant to do lots of things on my phone, so it is a necessary thing in life. I updated the memory a couple years ago, which is always helpful. But, the processor is easily overwhelmed, and of course the disk sometimes whirrs a lot. It takes forever to boot up, and it sometimes crashes during start up or when trying to do windows updates, which is what worries me the most. My last tower (ten years ago) was an HP and the motherboard just randomly died - I tried replacing the power supply and couldn't even get to the BIOS. That is why I went with ASUS, because the first party hardware is supposedly better.
Replacing it would cost $849 for something that I feel is appropriately obsolescence resistant and could get me another decade, but it isn't a good time to spend money for me. It is funny that towers have gone up in price and laptops went down... but I'm assuming there is a strong "get what you pay for" going on.
Ideas to stretch it out? Am I doomed? I've run CC cleaner and that helped a bit with bizarre busy-ness on the processor. I've done the thing where you go through and shut down unncessary background tasks, get rid of bloatware, and so on. I'm considering removing my anti-virus (Avast) to just free up resources. It never finds anything, because I never do anything risky enough for it to matter.
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 20, 2024 11:58:03 GMT -5
If it matters, my processor is "AMD A8-5500 APU with Radeon(tm) HD Graphics", and I have a whopping 24gb of RAM in there. It shipped with Windows 8, but got the free updates to Windows 10.
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Post by Leftee on Jan 20, 2024 12:16:09 GMT -5
I’d use windows defender from MS and ditch the Avast.
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 20, 2024 12:25:51 GMT -5
Yeah, I read that bit of advice a while ago, that seems to be the standard advice for older systems. I hadn't done it yet because only sometimes does the task manager say Avast is using much, but who knows if that is the whole story. As I type this, my computer freezes for a second when the ads change on the message board... maybe Avast is holding that up to make sure an ad isn't a virus or something?
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009
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Post by 009 on Jan 20, 2024 12:45:02 GMT -5
I think you should consider the need to have Windows 10 support beyond October 2025. There is a slew of articles about dealing with the end of Win 10 support -- this one is pretty good: www.zdnet.com/article/when-windows-10-support-ends-you-have-5-options-but-only-2-are-worth-considering/At some point I'll be upgrading my hardware. A new computer altogether is easy, of course, but the new models do not have the plentiful array of ports, memory card readers and DVD/CD reader/writers that I have now and am used to. I like my HP (my second one, my third after initially getting a Dell) because it's has so many features; it's like a Swiss Army Knife, and I've never had any issue with it; purchased in 2012. My alternative solution is to upgrade the motherboard, a loaded motherboard if they exist (I believe they are available). I've read that ASUS boards are reliable. (As for me, I would not buy anything new if Win 10 would be supported for a few more years, in spite of my HDD always spinning every time I close a web site.) If I had your problems, I'd be looking for new hardware. Maybe a used Win 11-capable computer, or a replacement motherboard (with processor and memory installed). That would take some research, figuring out the size, style, etc., of motherboard that fits in your case. (I'm tempted to go to Best Buy to buy one, and get some knowledgeable purchase and installation advice, etc.; I'm going to wait at least another year to do this... or buy a new computer....) |
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Post by markfromhawaii on Jan 20, 2024 12:45:32 GMT -5
If you do decide to replace it, I’d look into a machine with a solid state drive. You could also have a qualified tech retrieve all your data and programs, remove your mechanical hard drive and install an IDE SSD but that might be wash compared to just getting a new tower. I started getting near the limit of my machine with a 250 GB SSD so I ordered a replacement 512 GB SSD and some additional DRAM from Dell and had a tech do the work. It was ready in a couple days and I’m happy for now. Running Win 10 OS because I really don’t want to upgrade to 11 until I absolutely need to. Speaking of death clock, how’s your BIOS battery doing?
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 20, 2024 13:05:30 GMT -5
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 20, 2024 13:17:52 GMT -5
Checked that ZDNet article... my takeaways are that I'll PROBABLY be in a new PC by then anyway. I'm thinking about the next 6-12 months mostly. But, it talks about Win12 coming out, and whether I need to be ready for that or wait until I can get something that will ship with it. But, that's another rabbit hole about it being "AI based" (which sounds more like advertising than anything else) and I don't know if that will make Win11 one of the "good ol' days" OSes like 3.1, XP or Win7. That said, I was fine with Vista and Win8, so I'd probably be okay as an early adopter. It seems like memory is the big thing, and if I'm buying something with expandable memory (a big "yes" with a tower) that is HOPEFULLY not an issue.
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Post by 009 on Jan 20, 2024 13:57:37 GMT -5
Here's another article that came up from a search, re: Windows 12 hardware requirements. I don't understand much of it, but if you want to dabble in AI, then waiting for the release of Win 12 and new computers built/optimized for Win 12 is the safe way to go (it seems to me; seemingly conflicting statements...?). I'll be waiting for sure, now. (But I'll have to research Win 12 & computers further.) www.zdnet.com/article/windows-12-faq-yes-its-coming-in-2024-and-more-surprising-predictions/So, maybe putting a Band Aid on your computer that will allow it to operate reasonably well for another year or so is the "best" way to go for now. CCleaner (free version) has that "Performance Optimizer" feature (vertical feature listing, left side of screen). I have not tried it; have you? Best Buy sells a lot of refurbished computers; the HPs seem OK. The Dells are OLD and get low review grades. If you have a pretty nice guitar you're willing to part with, perhaps you can offer it up on Craigslist for a computer? Or, better, just sell the guitar for cash. I don't know. I'd probably find a sales guy in Best Buy and tell him what I need/want; maybe there would be a floor model or some recently discontinued model they'd be trying to unload for a good price. People are always returning stuff just because of some flippant reason --> "open box" price. |
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 20, 2024 14:14:55 GMT -5
I mean, I can always throw it on a credit card if the thing dies on me, it is just far from prudent. I'm working on unburying from medical bills and other debts, and adding more debts is a bad idea. If I spend more than a hundo or two, I'd want to do it right because I know my money will go the furthest.
I'm not seeing much on Win12 either, and no one is quite sure what it'll mean. I just want to be ahead of the curve on obsolescence, and it looks like that PROBABLY isn't an issue, unless Win11 loses support sooner than I thought. It is also possible if I get a Win11 machine they'll do a free upgrade since it would be relatively new, and I might be fine as long as I have enough memory. I'm completely fine with spending money on adding memory anyway; I've done it several times, and I'm a "too many open tabs" kind of guy, so it suits me. The article makes it sound like they won't do too much for hardware requirements, and the AI sounds more like peripheral features... which I'd probably turn off, anyway. If all they have an AI version of Clippy or Cortana that they want everyone to love but will actually hate, then it sounds like I'd be missing out on very little.
I've done most of the performance optimization stuff, and I have to be careful with it. For reasons I don't understand, my computer almost bricks whenever it tries to update drivers. It changes the display driver to something weird that doesn't work and the computer has to do some weird default thing that makes it look like a color Commodore 64 screen. It has done it twice, and both times it took several hours of searching for the right old driver to make it work again each time. Probably the fault of my LG monitor and not the computer, but who knows. I think removing Avast is the biggest thing now, but I'm going to wait until I back up some stuff first. I'm not 100% sure it'll survive the process. It gets really weird with any updates/changes that require rebooting.
edited to add: will keep on eye on Best Buy. The model I linked above is also available there, so I might get lucky.
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Post by 009 on Jan 20, 2024 14:40:08 GMT -5
At one time my computer got really troublesome. I read that sometimes you have to do a clean install/reinstallation of Windows. I did this -- saved all my data folders (Documents, Pictures/Photos, Music, Videos, Favorites, Desktop, etc.). Also exported all my email (to be imported later). Reformat the HDD. You have to install Win 10 (I have a disc), and then let it update. Then reinstall all your programs; if you installed any via internet/download, be sure to have all your passwords, etc. to go on the respective web site and download again. Copy all those data folders/items back onto the HDD. Well, it's a PITA, but it worked. If you have a "D" partition on your HDD (a backup copy of Windows itself [none of your data is located there]) maybe you can reinstall Windows itself from there. Yes, sort of like a rescue disc or flash drive --> you can make (should make) a recue disc or drive now; see or search your settings. PS - I could not find your model, but whatever you might consider at Best Buy, look for that highlighted link: Open-Box: from $394.99. There are about three levels of "quality" - excellent, very good, fair..... The prices are pretty good vs. new. I'm sure you'd get at least a 15-day return warranty. www.bestbuy.com/site/asus-performance-desktop-intel-core-i5-12400-8gb-memory-512gb-ssd-black/6511875.p?skuId=6511875...not real powerful, but seems pretty good, otherwise. |
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 20, 2024 14:54:50 GMT -5
I've considered that and may look into it... potential problems are 1) my PC shipped with Windows 8 and got a free upgrade. I have no idea what would happen... would I stay at Windows 8? Would it upgrade on its own? And, 2) the updates would take a long time and have a lot of reboot cycles which might be counter productive.
Sorry, I feel like I'm immediately dismissing all suggestions. Hahahaha
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Post by 009 on Jan 20, 2024 14:57:28 GMT -5
(see my last post & edit, re: open box prices at Best Buy.)
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Post by themaestro on Jan 20, 2024 15:06:04 GMT -5
Maybe someone mentioned it earlier. Didn't have time to read all the replies.
If it is still running a rotating disk HHD, THE BEST way to speed up an old computer is to put a solid state SSD drive in it. The read/write speeds of an SSD is so much faster than an HDD, and the latest operating systems do a LOT of constant disk access. It is the single most effective thing you can do to speed up an old computer.
Copy/backup from the old drive to the new one can be pretty easy. Some SSDs come as a conversion kit, which include a pigtail and software to plug the SSD into a USB port and clone your HDD to the SSD. It works easiest if the SSD is equal to or larger than the capacity of your SSD.
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Post by reverendrob on Jan 21, 2024 6:49:06 GMT -5
Your biggest concerns on the "death clock" so to speak: teh age of the processor - Intel lives forever, AMD will overheat and die a LOT easier with age. You've made it past the 5 year point though, so I'd put odds at lower.
Your powers upply in the tower might be long on its legs, and fans might past MTBF.
Realistically, ride it out.
And I wouldn't worry a whole lot about the "end of support" right off honestly - you're still looking at over a year, which is plenty of time to watch and plan.
I should also note that it's not a pure drop dead date on "end of support" either -while I wouldn't recommend it for the average user, I still have a Windows 7 laptop running for some things, and it's been out of support for a decade!
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Post by Vibroluxer on Jan 21, 2024 9:31:01 GMT -5
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Post by Leftee on Jan 21, 2024 9:53:20 GMT -5
I’ve had great luck with Refurb and Renewed technology from Amazon.
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Post by 009 on Jan 21, 2024 11:25:53 GMT -5
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 21, 2024 14:26:22 GMT -5
Your biggest concerns on the "death clock" so to speak: teh age of the processor - Intel lives forever, AMD will overheat and die a LOT easier with age. You've made it past the 5 year point though, so I'd put odds at lower. Your powers upply in the tower might be long on its legs, and fans might past MTBF. Realistically, ride it out. And I wouldn't worry a whole lot about the "end of support" right off honestly - you're still looking at over a year, which is plenty of time to watch and plan. I should also note that it's not a pure drop dead date on "end of support" either -while I wouldn't recommend it for the average user, I still have a Windows 7 laptop running for some things, and it's been out of support for a decade! Fan is noisy on cold days, but seems fine. I have an app that assesses hard drive "health" and it puts it at "good".... I wonder if there are any ways to peak at the processor or power supply? I generally keep it pretty clean, blasting out dust a few times a year, and it tends not to run for very long hours. I haven't monkeyed with it by trying to overclock it or anything, either. |
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Post by 009 on Jan 21, 2024 14:48:45 GMT -5
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 21, 2024 15:25:23 GMT -5
Interesting. Giving me some good information, but I'm not sure if I can decode it enough to determine "is it going to die on me in the next 12 months". hahaha
Looks like the disk is okay. I can't find any utilities for AMD, though it seems like Intel has one just for their own stuff. I do have a program CPU-Z, which has a "stress" routine, I'm guessing that will give me some insight?
It seems like since my problems are slow down and weird stuff with updates, it doesn't necessarily point to the CPU, since that would probably give a blue screen of death, sometimes during just mundane tasks. Does that sound about right?
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Post by Vibroluxer on Jan 21, 2024 16:40:27 GMT -5
I have always been able to get my machines to work and be reliable but when it comes time to decide to upgrade or buy another, newer machine, I always spent the time upgrading.
No more. It takes far too much time running these things and making adjustments in the bios and testing to make it worth while. Keep in mind I just use my computer for generally easy things. Im not creating bitcoins! So now if I start thinking upgrade, I just get another one. For $400 bucks I can get general piece of mind and a better computing experience.
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009
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Post by 009 on Jan 21, 2024 16:51:38 GMT -5
Sounds right to me, but I don't know much....
When you initially said you ran CCleaner, did you run the Registry check (in addition to the basic cleaning out of temp files)? I've had instances of flaky behavior, and then running/cleaning --> scan for issues, select all & correct all seemed to fix stuff.
Maybe you need defrag your HDD? Just guessing here. Windows has a utility for that. Checking the HDD for errors (like the CKDISK [?] utility) may report a physically healthy disc, but it still could contain/have recorded on it tons of disjointed data, so that reading/retrieving, maybe writing, "seeking" would be taking place all over the place, going here & there (vs. have unified data within a single sector of the HDD) making things slow.
PS - Vibroluxer posted while I was typing... Yes,... I'm even tempted to go for that ($402...?) Dell that I linked to above (you can buy an SD card adapter/reader on ebay for peanuts).
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Post by 009 on Jan 21, 2024 17:12:47 GMT -5
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Post by reverendrob on Jan 21, 2024 20:18:04 GMT -5
Interesting. Giving me some good information, but I'm not sure if I can decode it enough to determine "is it going to die on me in the next 12 months". hahaha Looks like the disk is okay. I can't find any utilities for AMD, though it seems like Intel has one just for their own stuff. I do have a program CPU-Z, which has a "stress" routine, I'm guessing that will give me some insight? It seems like since my problems are slow down and weird stuff with updates, it doesn't necessarily point to the CPU, since that would probably give a blue screen of death, sometimes during just mundane tasks. Does that sound about right? Yea, that tool will give you some insight. It's a case of it's likely going to keep running for the immediate future as is - a certain amount of accepting it's "slower" goes with the territory as new patches etc add more overhead to an older system. If it still meets your need, I'd consider the "sunk cost" of chasing what will be MARGINAL improvements at best trying to "improve" the existing thing with software tweaks etc. It's a long deep rabbit hole - your time is worth something, isn't it? |
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Post by funkykikuchiyo on Jan 23, 2024 9:03:50 GMT -5
Interesting. Giving me some good information, but I'm not sure if I can decode it enough to determine "is it going to die on me in the next 12 months". hahaha Looks like the disk is okay. I can't find any utilities for AMD, though it seems like Intel has one just for their own stuff. I do have a program CPU-Z, which has a "stress" routine, I'm guessing that will give me some insight? It seems like since my problems are slow down and weird stuff with updates, it doesn't necessarily point to the CPU, since that would probably give a blue screen of death, sometimes during just mundane tasks. Does that sound about right? Yea, that tool will give you some insight. It's a case of it's likely going to keep running for the immediate future as is - a certain amount of accepting it's "slower" goes with the territory as new patches etc add more overhead to an older system. If it still meets your need, I'd consider the "sunk cost" of chasing what will be MARGINAL improvements at best trying to "improve" the existing thing with software tweaks etc. It's a long deep rabbit hole - your time is worth something, isn't it? Yeah, I think you've hit the ultimate conclusion. I definitely think it is a "sunk cost" thing in terms of $$$, especially since it seems like the CPU is the weakest link at this point. An SSD does look like a good upgrade, but it doesn't seem like a good use of money right now. I'm no opposed to spending time with it as long as stuff is risk free and isn't going to create more problems, but at this point I think the only thing left is ditching Avast... and I've already turned off a lot of background stuff on it so I don't think it is THAT intrusive. I'm a bit paranoid that it might do wonky things if I remove it, so I may let it stay... at least for a while. It sounds like: hard drive is okay, everything else is okay, if the processor or motherboard were having issues, I'd be getting random crashes or the blue screen of death, and I'll use those as the canary in the coal mine. And, knowing the warning signs of impending doom is really want I want the most out of this at this point. Waiting for Win12 PROBABLY won't matter, but it seems like a prudent choice regardless. It'll buy me some time to consider the open box stuff or see if I really need another ASUS or if I'd be okay with HP or Dell. Since running CC cleaner a couple weeks ago, I haven't had any of those crashes at shut down/start up or during updates, but I also haven't had any giant updates since then, so it might be too early to say. Those were the scariest thing, so hopefully that's fixed. I just ran the program with the basic stuff, not the "premium" (that I could probably get with a free trial or something), because I don't want it messing with drivers - as I mentioned before, whenever one of those programs tries to put in the "right" display driver, it makes a big mess that takes several hours to fix. Sure, it'll start grunting if I right click over a web page or try to open the calendar without advance notice, but that doesn't bug me. My desktop is essential insofar as I do some things with it I'll never do on my phone, but realistically I don't log that many hours on it. Thanks fellas! |
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