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Post by gato on Feb 24, 2021 7:43:52 GMT -5
I don't live in New York City. And I don't live in London. Nevertheless, I felt a pang of regret when I read today that there are more millionaires across the pond than in NYC. In fact, one in 10 residents of London are millionaires.
"874,354 people in London have assets, including property, worth more than $1m, which makes them so-called “high net worth individuals” (HNWIs). That compares with 820,000 in New York, in second place." Of course, the Knight Report that cited these numbers, glossed over the 28% of Londoners living in poverty. And if you're a high rolling millionaire in a limo, your commute still gets delayed by that disheveled guy in the crosswalk, pushing a shopping cart. Best bet? Move to Kenya, where to be in the 1% club of richest people in the country, all you need is $20,000.
(I hear there about a million princes and kings in Nigeria, but their assets are untapped: they need someone in the US willing to do a check for cash swap, to realize their potential)
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Post by Mfitz804 on Feb 24, 2021 7:55:36 GMT -5
Is a million dollars, including your real estate holdings, even impressive anymore? The median house value here in Staten Island is $609k. Granted, our real estate prices are higher than most, but still.
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Post by Leftee on Feb 24, 2021 8:14:37 GMT -5
If you have a back yard big enough for a giraffe to graze.
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Post by gato on Feb 24, 2021 9:41:33 GMT -5
Is a million dollars, including your real estate holdings, even impressive anymore? The median house value here in Staten Island is $609k. Granted, our real estate prices are higher than most, but still. Yes, according to the report it does include real estate holdings. Out here on the west coast, my follow-the-bouncing-ball home value, combined with everything else, puts me into the "Paper Millionaire " category. But you wouldn't know it, looking at my ratty lounge chair and chipped dishes. Not to mention my threadbare JC Penney briefs. "JC Penney briefs?" I told you not to mention them!
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Post by Mfitz804 on Feb 24, 2021 11:20:10 GMT -5
If I mention them, I will do so briefly.
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Post by tahitijack on Feb 24, 2021 11:25:15 GMT -5
NYC is not the richest city in the US. There are several others with higher percapita income, mostly in Florida and California of course. BTW Newport Beach is the largest small boat harbor in the world. Most of those boats are NOT small.
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Post by Larry Madsen on Feb 24, 2021 11:33:43 GMT -5
Is a million dollars, including your real estate holdings, even impressive anymore? The median house value here in Staten Island is $609k. Obviously "where" you live plays into it. Also how much of your million is tied into living space plays into it, along again, with where you live. Having a million dollar house and no liquid cash (or cash flow) would prove to be useless wealth over the long haul. Not sure what it takes to be "a Rich Man", but If I'm able to carry on in the style I am currently accustom to, I'm pretty much "a Happy Man".
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Post by Mfitz804 on Feb 24, 2021 12:28:44 GMT -5
Is a million dollars, including your real estate holdings, even impressive anymore? The median house value here in Staten Island is $609k. Obviously "where" you live plays into it. Also how much of your million is tied into living space plays into it, along again, with where you live. Having a million dollar house and no liquid cash (or cash flow) would prove to be useless wealth over the long haul. Not sure what it takes to be "a Rich Man", but If I'm able to carry on in the style I am currently accustom to, I'm pretty much "a Happy Man". Well of course. But I was referring to the article in the OP, which talks about people with assets over $1m including real property. My argument was, depending where you live, $1m including your house is not a rich person whatsoever.
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Post by Larry Madsen on Feb 24, 2021 12:36:02 GMT -5
depending where you live, $1m including your house is not a rich person whatsoever. Agreed. Edited to add: I can't help but recall some of the occasional customers I had while running my service business. While doing what I did I spent my time in most all of, including the most intimate, parts of peoples houses. I would sometimes have some customer (usually a younger guy) with some Waa-Zoo Corvette or Porsche maybe even something more exotic than that. You get inside the house and discover that every meaningful possession they have is out in the garage. Somehow I always figured their bank account probably reflected the same.
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Post by slacker 🐨 on Feb 24, 2021 13:17:55 GMT -5
depending where you live, $1m including your house is not a rich person whatsoever. Agreed. Edited to add: I can't help but recall some of the occasional customers I had while running my service business. While doing what I did I spent my time in most all of, including the most intimate, parts of peoples houses. I would sometimes have some customer (usually a younger guy) with some Waa-Zoo Corvette or Porsche maybe even something more exotic than that. You get inside the house and discover that every meaningful possession they have is out in the garage. Somehow I always figured their bank account probably reflected the same. Yeah, I been shocked a number of times seeing an $80k BMW parked in front of a dilapidated trailer. The priorities of some people shock me. I knew a couple (deadbeat relatives) that got evicted from their apartment a couple months after blowing a $2000 tax return on a huge flat screen TV, gaming console and games. They also had smart phones. At the time, I did not have a flat screen TV or a smart phone and I was making 6 figures.
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Post by gato on Feb 24, 2021 13:42:14 GMT -5
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Post by Mfitz804 on Feb 24, 2021 13:45:28 GMT -5
I know someone living in a house worth over seven figures who hasn’t worked in well over a year and a half and hasn’t got a penny in the bank.
You never know what people’s situations are.
Around here, it’s common for people to sell their house, move to a condo or a 55 and over community, and give the rest of the proceeds to their children. This results in people being able to afford a much nicer house than they would have otherwise be able to afford, and you look at them, see they both work in ok jobs, but they appear to be doing way better than you are.
Not always the case.
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Post by Leftee on Feb 24, 2021 13:47:11 GMT -5
I know someone living in a house worth over seven figures who hasn’t worked in well over a year and a half and hasn’t got a penny in the bank. You never know what people’s situations are. Around here, it’s common for people to sell their house, move to a condo or a 55 and over community, and give the rest of the proceeds to their children. This results in people being able to afford a much nicer house than they would have otherwise be able to afford, and you look at them, see they both work in ok jobs, but they appear to be doing way better than you are. Not always the case. How do they even put the taxes on it?
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Post by gato on Feb 24, 2021 13:52:34 GMT -5
I've always been a fan of that bumper sticker:
"I'm spending my children's inheritance".
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Post by Leftee on Feb 24, 2021 13:53:06 GMT -5
I've always been a fan of that bumper sticker: "I'm spending my children's inheritance". Me too. I wish I could afford one.
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Post by Mfitz804 on Feb 24, 2021 14:06:31 GMT -5
I know someone living in a house worth over seven figures who hasn’t worked in well over a year and a half and hasn’t got a penny in the bank. You never know what people’s situations are. Around here, it’s common for people to sell their house, move to a condo or a 55 and over community, and give the rest of the proceeds to their children. This results in people being able to afford a much nicer house than they would have otherwise be able to afford, and you look at them, see they both work in ok jobs, but they appear to be doing way better than you are. Not always the case. How do they even put the taxes on it? That’s another thing, you never know how in the hole someone is. You can be years behind on taxes in NY before anything happens, and even then, you may wind up with a lien that has to be addressed only when you sell or try to take out money. In 2021, you could have not paid your mortgage for over a year and the bank will not yet be foreclosing. You could have family money. You could have a disability claim that brings in money either from the State or a private disability policy, and you can squeak by on it. This is exactly what I mean, just because it LOOKS like someone is doing better than you, it doesn’t always mean they are.
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Post by Leftee on Feb 24, 2021 14:09:12 GMT -5
*pay
Stoopid autocarrot
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Post by Larry Madsen on Feb 24, 2021 14:35:22 GMT -5
During the crash of 2008 I had several customers I would have thought were quite well set financially. Some still ended up losing their house and I never saw or heard from them again.
I can say this with certainty.
In tough times for many (like right now) having zero debt can make one feel like a rich man.
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Ayns
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Post by Ayns on Feb 24, 2021 14:54:09 GMT -5
Average property prices in London (including flats/apartments) is over £500k. Average for terraced properties is circa £750k.
Average salary for London is around £40k
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Post by gato on Feb 24, 2021 16:41:43 GMT -5
Average property prices in London (including flats/apartments) is over £500k. Average for terraced properties is circa £750k. Average salary for London is around £40k Thanks to the Beatles and Goldfinger.
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Post by jhawkr on Feb 24, 2021 16:53:38 GMT -5
I own everything I have outright. No loans, no debt. I planned my retirement that way. So far, I have not spent a penny of my retirement funds in almost 2 years and have managed strictly on SS the wife and I receive. Probably couldn’t do that in NYC or SF or London. And I don’t care as I never wanted to live in any of those places. You plan based of expectations and locale(s) you expect to end up.
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Post by Mfitz804 on Feb 24, 2021 16:59:18 GMT -5
My retirement plan most definitely does not include being in New York.
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Post by jhawkr on Feb 24, 2021 17:40:53 GMT -5
Everyone knows New Yorkers are future Floridians. 🙂
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Ayns
Wholenote
Posts: 767
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Post by Ayns on Feb 24, 2021 18:56:43 GMT -5
Average property prices in London (including flats/apartments) is over £500k. Average for terraced properties is circa £750k. Average salary for London is around £40k Thanks to the Beatles and Goldfinger. You couldn't pay me to live in London, and I haven't visited for a few years, but I understand that large parts of central London are owned by multi billionaire Russian oligarchs and Arab princes.
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Post by FlyonNylon on Feb 24, 2021 20:24:56 GMT -5
I wouldn’t really consider a home as part of your net worth in most circumstances since.. after liquidating it you still need some place to live.
$1m liquid is still a lot of money for a single person since at 4% safe withdrawal rate gives you $40k per year so basically financially independent.
I’d say for a family something like $2.5m is the new “millionaire” status.
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Post by Mfitz804 on Feb 24, 2021 20:28:01 GMT -5
I wouldn’t really consider a home as part of your net worth in most circumstances since.. after liquidating it you still need some place to live. $1m liquid is still a lot of money for a single person since at 4% safe withdrawal rate gives you $40k per year so basically financially independent. I’d say for a family something like $2.5m is the new “millionaire” status. Yes, one million liquid is a lot for one person. Whether $40k annual is enough to live on, maybe yes, maybe no.
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Post by Larry Madsen on Feb 24, 2021 20:43:57 GMT -5
Yes, one million liquid is a lot for one person. Whether $40k annual is enough to live on, maybe yes, maybe no. As a 20 year old planning a life around a million could easily lead to trouble. If it were retirement aspects of this we are concerned with ... a person can tack on another $24,000.00 give or take (@ year) from Social Security and it gets a lot better for average Joe with the liquid million. Again though it boils down to life style. Not to mention by retirement there is less concern about cutting into the principle amount to some degree. I'm probably taking this discussion to a different place though mentioning that.
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Post by jhawkr on Feb 24, 2021 21:23:48 GMT -5
Unless you plan on living forever or want to maximize what you leave to heirs, you don’t need to keep the principal intact. A million can go quite a ways. Of course, if you want to spend like Eric Clapton, you’ll be needing much more.
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Bbendfender
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Mostly play Fender guitars and amps. I'm 71 and have had a guitar since 1964. Got serious in 1975.
Posts: 216
Age: 71
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Post by Bbendfender on Feb 24, 2021 22:08:53 GMT -5
I'd say several folks on this forum have $1M in cash, in the bank or invested. $1M is just not what it used to be. Remember the old show from the 60's, "The Millionare"?
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Post by gato on Feb 25, 2021 6:16:37 GMT -5
Unless you plan on living forever or want to maximize what you leave to heirs, you don’t need to keep the principal intact. A million can go quite a ways. Of course, if you want to spend like Eric Clapton, you’ll be needing much more. Or Nicholas Cage
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